Helpful ReplyHot!Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops...

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joerogo
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 14:27:29 (permalink)
JRPfeff
Maybe I was eating at the wrong places, but the pasta I was served on my trip to Italy was all disappointing. Kind of like the food I had in Japan, too.

I have Anerican tastes and prefer the Americanized versions of ethnic foods.

That's cuz ya didn't ask me where to go! :)
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1bbqboy
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 14:59:17 (permalink)
Do you swim in sauce, Joe?
Seriously, I just think Italians have assimilated into the culture to the extent that these grandma arguments aren't relevant any more. Every thing Ketteract finds looks luscious to me.
@Ketteract- did you eat much Italian when you were in KC? There used to be a fair amount of places just like you describe in CT. As far as I can tell, almost the whole of KC Italians were from Sicily, which certainly promoted one style of food. I'm sure it's different now.
#32
joerogo
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 16:15:19 (permalink)
1bbqboy
Do you swim in sauce, Joe?
Seriously, I just think Italians have assimilated into the culture to the extent that these grandma arguments aren't relevant any more. Every thing Ketteract finds looks luscious to me.
@Ketteract- did you eat much Italian when you were in KC? There used to be a fair amount of places just like you describe in CT. As far as I can tell, almost the whole of KC Italians were from Sicily, which certainly promoted one style of food. I'm sure it's different now.
There is no rule, written or unwritten. My mother tells me I eat just like my Italian born grandfather.....extra sauce!!!
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1bbqboy
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 16:31:53 (permalink)
That's our Joe! :)
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Ketteract
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 17:38:57 (permalink)
1bbqboy
@Ketteract- did you eat much Italian when you were in KC? There used to be a fair amount of places just like you describe in CT. As far as I can tell, almost the whole of KC Italians were from Sicily, which certainly promoted one style of food. I'm sure it's different now.




When I was in KC (2004-2012), my sense of food-adventure was still developing, but on the surface, at least, Italian food didn't seem to be one of KC's strengths.  I mean, I'm sure that in a metro area that large, there were good places from all the categories I listed before - I just didn't really get to see them.
 
One KC joint that I've mentioned here before is the drive-thru remnant of the old Italian Gardens restaurant that sat downtown for decades.  I discovered it because of its close proximity to my apartment complex.  It occupied a tiny building in the northland before moving down to Overland Park and finally closing for good a while later.  They had an interesting selection that included Italian steak sandwiches, Italian beef sandwiches (which had been removed before this menu was printed), toasted ravioli, and my favorite item of all: a roll stuffed with a meatball, or a chunk of sausage, and sauce, for $1.  
 

 

 

#35
JRPfeff
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 18:24:54 (permalink)
joerogo
JRPfeff
Maybe I was eating at the wrong places, but the pasta I was served on my trip to Italy was all disappointing. Kind of like the food I had in Japan, too.

I have Anerican tastes and prefer the Americanized versions of ethnic foods.

That's cuz ya didn't ask me where to go! :)


My usual rule in life is Rogo = No Go, but if you're going to show me around Italy I will definitely follow.
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1bbqboy
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 18:30:49 (permalink)
Ketteract
1bbqboy
@Ketteract- did you eat much Italian when you were in KC? There used to be a fair amount of places just like you describe in CT. As far as I can tell, almost the whole of KC Italians were from Sicily, which certainly promoted one style of food. I'm sure it's different now.




When I was in KC (2004-2012), my sense of food-adventure was still developing, but on the surface, at least, Italian food didn't seem to be one of KC's strengths.  I mean, I'm sure that in a metro area that large, there were good places from all the categories I listed before - I just didn't really get to see them.
 
One KC joint that I've mentioned here before is the drive-thru remnant of the old Italian Gardens restaurant that sat downtown for decades.  I discovered it because of its close proximity to my apartment complex.  It occupied a tiny building in the northland before moving down to Overland Park and finally closing for good a while later.  They had an interesting selection that included Italian steak sandwiches, Italian beef sandwiches (which had been removed before this menu was printed), toasted ravioli, and my favorite item of all: a roll stuffed with a meatball, or a chunk of sausage, and sauce, for $1.  
 

 

 


Kind of iffy out in the burbs, especially Kansas side, but believe me, plenty of Italians in KC. I worked for them. :)
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lleechef
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 19:50:21 (permalink)
joerogo
JRPfeff
Maybe I was eating at the wrong places, but the pasta I was served on my trip to Italy was all disappointing. Kind of like the food I had in Japan, too.

I have Anerican tastes and prefer the Americanized versions of ethnic foods.

That's cuz ya didn't ask me where to go! :)


No kidding, Joe!!!!!  I'm not even a fan of pasta but in Italy I could've eaten it three times a day!
#38
leethebard
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 20:03:52 (permalink)
lleechef
joerogo
JRPfeff
Maybe I was eating at the wrong places, but the pasta I was served on my trip to Italy was all disappointing. Kind of like the food I had in Japan, too.

I have Anerican tastes and prefer the Americanized versions of ethnic foods.

That's cuz ya didn't ask me where to go! :)


No kidding, Joe!!!!!  I'm not even a fan of pasta but in Italy I could've eaten it three times a day!


Cuz they don't drown it in sauce!!!!
#39
lleechef
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/05 21:25:30 (permalink)
leethebard
lleechef
joerogo
JRPfeff
Maybe I was eating at the wrong places, but the pasta I was served on my trip to Italy was all disappointing. Kind of like the food I had in Japan, too.

I have Anerican tastes and prefer the Americanized versions of ethnic foods.

That's cuz ya didn't ask me where to go! :)


No kidding, Joe!!!!!  I'm not even a fan of pasta but in Italy I could've eaten it three times a day!


Cuz they don't drown it in sauce!!!!


Exactly!!!!!!!
#40
Ketteract
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 14:16:22 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby joerogo 2017/04/06 15:55:22
It was cloudy and rainy in Hartford today, so I hit Corner Grinder for a comfort-food lunch. Ordered a bowl of their pasta fazool, and shells with sauce, a meatball, and a sausage.
 
This seemed like the perfect corner.
 

 
I'd seen this bread by the register the last time I was here, but at the time, I'd passed. It's included with entrees.
 

 
... Wow. It seemed to me that this was what crusty Italian bread was supposed to be all about. Undoubtedly housemade. I wished it were what they employed in their grinders, but perhaps producing sufficient quantities would be an issue. Maybe one could make a custom request.
 

 
I enjoyed it so much with just a little butter that I hardly had any left to soak in the pasta fazool.
 

 
How beautiful is that?
 

 
They use, I'm told by a coworker who knows the family that runs the place, an entire chicken to make the stock for their pasta e fagioli fazool. I can believe it. This was tremendously good, with a nice veggie flavor that stood out, and exactly the thing to eat on a day like this. I believe acini di pepe would be the term for the type of pasta they used.
 
There was also a basic salad with oil and vinegar. This was the same vinegar they used on my last grinder, and whatever it was, I didn't much care for it. Might have been a red wine vinegar.
 

 
And now... the stars of the show. When these were added to the array of dinnerware already on my table, an older gentleman (almost everyone seated was old enough to be my dad) a few seats away said: "I'm impressed."
 

 

 
The sauce... oh man. Fantastic, simply fantastic. On the tangy-to-sweet spectrum, it's in between Franklin's and Wethersfield's, with just a touch of sugar. To my tongue, it was the perfect amount. I had only sort of tasted the sauce in the chicken parm and meatball parm grinders that I'd had before, but here, it was allowed to sing. I imagine they're proud of it.  They damn well should be. I should ask next time if it's available in quantity.
 
The meatball was just as big as Franklin's, with the same firmness and finely-ground consistency, but a slightly stronger flavor.
 

 
The sausage was more like what I expected "Italian sausage" to be, firmer than Franklin's and more traditional-tasting. I think most folks would probably prefer this one, but that's pure presumption.
 

 
This was one hell of a lunch. It's obvious that Corner Grinder, despite the name, puts far more of an emphasis than Franklin on both non-sandwich foods and dining in - enough that I now consider them an eating destination.  I'm glad to have finally learned what all the longtime patrons already knew.
post edited by Ketteract - 2017/04/06 16:19:04
#41
lleechef
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 14:33:11 (permalink)
Such a beautiful lunch!  I have never seen pasta e fagioli like that before.  Oh!  Of course!  It was pasta fazool!  That is definitely acini di pepe.  Almost looks like there is a little bit of escarole in there too.  I'm glad your pasta wasn't drenched in sauce!  But I'm not so sure I would like dense meatballs.  Well, at any rate, it all looks great!
#42
chickenplucker
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 14:40:19 (permalink)
That all looks incredible.....
#43
mlm
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 15:13:53 (permalink)
The salad was just a gesture, I think, but, otherwise, SENSATIONAL..
#44
Ketteract
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 15:18:46 (permalink)
Isn't that pasta fazool just gorgeous?  Looking at it, I felt like I did when I first saw a cross-section of Franklin's Italian combo grinder: gratification that such stunning food should still be found in low-profile, time-worn establishments whose neighborhoods' glory days were long past.  
#45
joerogo
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 15:57:34 (permalink)
Putting Corner Grinder on my map now......
#46
ann peeples
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 16:44:44 (permalink)
Get over the sauce, people. If people want that, that's it. Good for you for having family that makes that. Should I talk about my grandmas roulden that you didn't make?
#47
Wintahaba
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 17:00:01 (permalink)
It all looks good.
#48
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 17:30:23 (permalink)
That soup looks great. I'd tie into a bowl or two of that. The pasta, not so much. I'm just not a fan of pasta dishes. Probably ate too many when we lived in Sicily and got burned out.
#49
Greymo
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 17:47:56 (permalink)
The whole meal looks great!  I am making that soup  for Monday evening's  dinner.  So what are you having for dinner?
#50
Ketteract
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 18:26:45 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby joerogo 2017/04/07 07:31:21
joerogo
Putting Corner Grinder on my map now......




I'm told that they're looking to sell, so you may want to visit sooner rather than later.  
#51
leethebard
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 20:01:01 (permalink)
Those shells and sauce look like our normal Sunday dinner. .......that soup looks like escarole soup with added acini pepe and cannelini beans added....perhaps doctored escarole soul...not typical pasta e fagiole. What I liked best was that bread which looks amazing.
#52
ScreamingChicken
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/06 20:03:51 (permalink)
Ketteract
This was one hell of a lunch.

I hope your snoring didn't disturb your coworkers.
post edited by ScreamingChicken - 2017/04/06 20:05:38
#53
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 09:31:22 (permalink)
leethebard
Those shells and sauce look like our normal Sunday dinner. .......that soup looks like escarole soup with added acini pepe and cannelini beans added....perhaps doctored escarole soul...not typical pasta e fagiole. What I liked best was that bread which looks amazing.


leethebard,


I don't see much difference between this ...

And, this ...

They both seem to "swim" to me.
 
I was served something like this in Italy ...

Only without the dollop of sauce in the middle.
 
So where is the line between perfection and swimming?
 
Jim
 
#54
leethebard
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 09:51:03 (permalink)
The Penne and small shells are swimming. The pasta is reduced to simply holding and providing a little bite to the sauce. Hell, just eat a bowl of sauce with dipping bread. That's NOT how good pasta should be served,unless it is hiding generic pasta. The last bowl is much better. Many places just toss a quality pasta(perhaps home made with a rich taste) in a quality sauce, coat it evenly and then serve.  That's the way Italians have served pasta since forever. If you like the non-Italian way,that's your dinner! We never order simple pasta and sauce out because we make it almost every sunday according to almost 100 year old recipes. In a quality Italian restaurant we would look for some unusual dishes we don't make at home, not pasta,ravioli, manicotti ,lasagna,veal or chicken parm,egg plant parm etc. We make that often at home, and we prefer our old recipes. That said, I've been wowed by some great dishes in some great restaurants here and in Italy, even France. Most pizza places make what Americans simply think is what Italian food means. ....and they usually make it poorly, as I feel those two dishes above are made. Bet that pasta was generic boxed pasta, but who could tell smothered in all that sauce(bet with lots of sugar added,the American way. Sorry, that's just the way I feel, words echoed to me by many Italians.Bottom line enjoy what your taste buds like...just hate when people rave about something they call is "ITALIAN" when no self respecting Italian would. That's more "Italian-American".
#55
Ketteract
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 10:04:13 (permalink)
leethebard
just hate when people rave about something they call is "ITALIAN" when no self respecting Italian would. That's more "Italian-American".




I believe the word "Italian", when used in the context of American grocers, sit-down restaurants, sandwich shops, is commonly understood to mean "Italian-American", but semantics aside, it should be pretty clear what kinds of places, proprietors, and foods this thread is intended to cover.  Comparisons to genuine, made-within-Italy cuisine are inevitable; it's fascinating to see what was brought across the sea and how it evolved.  That being said, while I understand the reflex to put the Italian-Italian way on a pedestal as "the proper way", "the way it should be done", etc... it's just not useful or constructive.  We do things differently over here, and that's just how it is - it's not inherently superior or inferior.
post edited by Ketteract - 2017/04/07 10:05:47
#56
leethebard
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 10:52:20 (permalink)
Ketteract
leethebard
just hate when people rave about something they call is "ITALIAN" when no self respecting Italian would. That's more "Italian-American".




I believe the word "Italian", when used in the context of American grocers, sit-down restaurants, sandwich shops, is commonly understood to mean "Italian-American", but semantics aside, it should be pretty clear what kinds of places, proprietors, and foods this thread is intended to cover.  Comparisons to genuine, made-within-Italy cuisine are inevitable; it's fascinating to see what was brought across the sea and how it evolved.  That being said, while I understand the reflex to put the Italian-Italian way on a pedestal as "the proper way", "the way it should be done", etc... it's just not useful or constructive.  We do things differently over here, and that's just how it is - it's not inherently superior or inferior.


"differently" is hardly a defense with many food people. Olive Garden, Pizza Hut, Mickey D's all do their food differently, but many gladly complain about the food as not being authentic, at best poor adaptations. Don't call Pizza hut authentic pizza, don't call some Italian-American", Italian. Hell some Italian-American places do it right. It's not about labels, and "WE" do it right in many places. That said,you enjoy McDonalds, eat it.You like a chain,go there, Eat what you like. And while I'd cringe at someone raving about a Dominoes pizza,or Olive Garden pasta, I cringe likewise at non-Italians thinking non-italian Italian food is great "Italian food" Sorry! 
#57
1bbqboy
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 11:00:30 (permalink)
You sound slightly silly, in this day and age. Do other ethnic groups similarly get their undies so twisted?
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Michael Hoffman
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 11:44:21 (permalink)
1bbqboy
You sound slightly silly, in this day and age. Do other ethnic groups similarly get their undies so twisted?

Have you ever been served chitterlings with mornay sauce?
#59
leethebard
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Re: Italian entrees at old grocers / sandwich shops... 2017/04/07 12:14:26 (permalink)
Michael Hoffman
1bbqboy
You sound slightly silly, in this day and age. Do other ethnic groups similarly get their undies so twisted?

Have you ever been served chitterlings with mornay sauce?


...or pierogis with tomato sauce?????? Hell, and the 21st century IS a century of labeling.....but it's not about labeling,If I served an ethnic food totally wrong,I wouldn't mind someone from that culture pointing that out to me...It's called live and LEARN. Again, that said, eat what you want...and if you want to keep calling something Italian that isn't prepared in the "Italian" way...fine. Just don't be shocked if some actual Italian points that out to you!
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